May 15, 2023

Governmental bodies and a front fence/gate (rev. 6/8/23)

FIVE GOVERNMENTAL BODIES get mentioned as possibly having some sway over a fence/gate in front of Mishkon’s historic sanctuary building. 

Below the jump, this post discusses each one — and what I know about its relevance to our situation.


Executive Summary

For the pedestrian gate of a perimeter fence, the city’s Department of Public Works would need to issue a permit—which means that a site survey might be needed, to show the property boundary. 

However, this need could almost surely be avoided for a “man trap” in front of the Social Hall doors, because the opened gate could be designed to not extend into the public right of way. (More refined measurements and discussions with the fabricator are needed for confirmation.) 

Other than that, no government oversight is involved.


City of Los Angeles Department of Building and Safety

No building permit is needed to install a fence/gate itself, as long as the posts are clearly on our own property.
From: LADBS ENGRCODE <ladbs.engrcode@lacity.org>
Date: May 23, 2021

As the property is zoned M1 [Light Industrial], there is no required front yard for that Zone, as such yes you can construct an 8 feet high fence.
Generally fences constructed out of metal or wood do not require a building permit.

City of Los Angeles Department of Public Works

If any part of the fence/gate (posts, cross-pieces, footings, pedestrian exit gate when opened, etc.) would extend into the public right of way, a “revocable permit” is needed. (According to the recollection of the city’s preservation architect, an opened gate cannot reach more than 12" into public property.) See HERE and HERE for details.

To apply for such a permit, a site survey is said to be needed, in order to show in some official way exactly where the property line is. We received a quote two years ago for a front-line only survey; at the time, it would have cost $2,200. The Federation grant would not fund such a survey.


City of Los Angeles  Planning Department

As our site is located within the Venice Coastal Zone Specific Plan, and two other overlays, we reached out out to the Dept. of City Planning to verify that there are no fence/gate restrictions as part of those plans.

According to two planning staff members reached by phone this month, those plans say nothing about fences/gates that would affect our project. Hence no Planning Dept. review is needed.

Coastal Commission

According to Mehrnoosh Mojallali, a local architect who sits on the Land-Use Committee of the Venice Neighborhood Council, no review by the Coastal Commission is warranted for this kind of project.

Judging from the Commission’s website, it is interested in fences/gates only if they affect public access to the coast or a beach.

Cultural Heritage Commission

According to Lambert Giessinger, who is the senior architect in the city’s Office of Historic Resources, our gate/fence project does not rise to the level of concern that would warrant a public hearing in front of the Cultural Heritage Commission. (It’s his call to make.) After a Zoom call today in which he saw photo mock-ups of the three configurations under consideration, he did not consider it to be a “substantial alteration” to the historic structure because it is in theory reversible. 

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“Thank you” to Barbara Levy, Marcy Drexler, Ed Geil, and Dayna Greenspan, for their assistance in research over the past 2 years.

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